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  • "rightans" started this thread

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Sunday, January 17th 2010, 8:36pm

Will I be able to breastfeed again?

My breastfeeding story so far:

I had a planned C section on last friday ie 8th. Even before the birth of my baby I was concerned about breast feeding as I really wanted to do it but had heard that having a section can affect milk production. So I told my midwife my concerns. After the birth of my boy we had skin to skin in recovery room. I was seen by a nursing consultant but she did not offer much help. But later my midwife showed me the basics of positioning and latching. On the postnatal ward I started breastfeeding my boy. I was offered some support. On sunday as I was not being offered much help in hospital and I was feeling really good and happy we came home. Since day 2 my boy has been feeding a lot every 1-2 hours and then when we came home on day 3 almost constantly. We were concerned that I am not producing enough milk as I could not express any out on squeezing my nipples. But the community midwife reassured me that there is nothing like that.

On day 4 evening things really became worse as my nipples got really sore, cracked and started bleeding and my boy became more and more restless. So I decided to breastfeed from my left side which is less sore and express from right side. I could express only 5ml or so each time using my manual pump. We had a nightmare of night; i was in tears with pain, my boy kept crying, my DH got dressed to get some formula milk in the middle of night but stopped when my boy fell asleep. on day 5 midwife came and measured our LO and said that he had lost 15.4% of his bodyweight and sent us to the admission unit. Obviously I became more stressed and tearful by then. We gave our lil boy another breastfeed but he hardly stayed on my breast so I asked DH to give him a formula before leaving for the hospital as it could be a long wait to see the doctor. We were seen by doctor late in the afternoon who agreed with us that it is a feeding issue. She took some bloods from our lil one. Then it was another long wait for the results during which time one of the nurses put me on electric breast pump. only about 10 ml came out at that session. Later on we were seen by another doctor who told us that blood results were a bit high and Chikoo is dehydrated. He let us go home on the promise that we will bottlefeed him and will not breastfeed until my nipples heal.

Since then that is what I have been doing. Giving him bottles of formula and expressed milk which is not more that 15 ml (1/2 oz) each session. I have been using lanolin cream since day 3. My nipples are bit healed now they still have pink and shiny patches on them. I had one small breastfeeding session with Chikoo yesterday and 2-3 sessions with him today. There is a latching issue. I have tried various holds. But he does not seem to open his mouth as wide. During the last session he came off breast and started crying really bad. He did seem to latched on well that time. At present it does seem like establishing breastfeeding again is going to be uphill task. He is gaining weight on formula and looks content. Sorry I have rambled on for a bit. But I would really appreciate any advise from experts or other ladies who have been in similar situations.

Will I be able to get back to breastfeeding again? If you were successful in making that switch how did it work for you?

i am using manual pump should i switch to an electric pump to see if it will increase my milk supply? can i take something to increase my milk supply? how frequently should i express milk?

there were many more questions but cant remember them now.

Michelle

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Sunday, January 17th 2010, 8:58pm

Hello rightans :cuddle it's so hard isn't it, i know how you feel as i had similar problems bf my dd at the beginning.

Firstly, i just wondered if your ds has been checked for a tongue-tie? The reason i ask is that you say he doesn't open his mouth very wide and can't latch on properly. If he's not been checked for this then perhaps ask your midwife next time you see her if she can look - if he does have a tongue-tie then having this snipped will improve that latch on significantly.
Otherwise, if it's a positioning/supply issue then you could ask about breastfeeding groups and councellors in your area where you can go to get specialist help with positioning techniques.

I personally don't think that 15mls is that bad at this early stage, without your baby stimulating your supply a pump will find it hard to get much more unless you pump very very frequently. I had both a manual and an electric pump and the electric one certainly got out more - i also found that i was more relaxed using it as i didn't think too hard about what i was doing. Your baby is the best pump though :smile: Have you thought of giving nipple shields a try if your nipples are very sore? I know it's not ideal but might help in the short term whilst latching issues are being resolved.

Sorry i can't help much more than that, i hope you find some of what i've said useful though and i'm sure some of the other breastfeeding mummy's will be along with great advice soon. Look after yourself, drink LOTS of fluids and try and sleep!

xx




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  • "rightans" started this thread

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Sunday, January 17th 2010, 9:07pm

Thanks Michelle for the quick reply. My lil one does not have a tongue tie. i have not tried nipple shields as yet. Have been giving them a thought but have read that they affect breast milk production. Have you used them? I am willing to give them a go if they would help. Thanks once again.

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Sunday, January 17th 2010, 9:40pm

Hi Rightans,
I have been exactly where you are, the C section (although not planned), the mixed advice from the midwives, the weight loss, the return to hospital, the anxiety, the guilt.... Sadly for me, Mooch never got the idea of latching on poperly and she only got breast milk down to my own sheer bloody mindedness. I expressed every few hours for 11 weeks, and as Michelle says a pump doesn't stimulate milk production like a baby so my milk dried up after that. She did latch on and feed once or twice but I was so terrified that she would loose weight again that I was too scared to stop the formula and so she very quickly realised that bottle was easier for her than breast. However, Michelle is proof that that doesn't always need to be the case. I think you need to do several things, first is get your positioning sorted, do you have a local baby bistro or breastfeeding group where there is someone who is properly trained to show you how to latch on properly? Sore and bleeding nipples are nearly always caused by poor positioning but its easily sorted. I would do this before you try nipple sheilds as they can cause other problems. Secondly... I ws going to post a load of waffle but this http://www.kellymom.com/bf/concerns/baby/back-to-breast.html (Not FZ endorsed) is really good advice I wish that I'd been told, I'm sure if I'd known even half of that I would have had a lot more success. Thirdly, you need to look after yourself, if you can, go to bed with your baby and just rest, try and feed, sing songs to him, read stories etc... sleep as much as you can and get DH to bring you food and drinks. I tried this with my LO and I truly believe that it helped her breastfeed as much as possible and also gave us both the benefits of skin to skin contact and I have really happy memories of us both snuggling up together.





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Monday, January 18th 2010, 12:26am

I feel your pain! On phone so cannot tell my whole story. Have had to top up with formula this week and express to bring my milk in as took ages. Sheer determination has led to me now exclusively bf and she gained 80g in last 2 days. With help from mw she now gets on better but still has issues opening mouth wife enough, esp on right. All i can say is that when she is crying it is easier as her mouth is wide then! Mw showed of how to hold her behind shoulders, get her close and when mouth wide enough push her on. Is all in the timing and can take us ages to get it right. Also my nipple is hard shape for her tiny mouth so have to kind of hold breast to shape it whilst trying to latch her on. It is getting a bit easier but often have to stop for a bit, calm myself and then try again. Find someone who can help you get a technique that will work for you and persevere. Good luck x


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pamelag088

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Monday, January 18th 2010, 1:27am

Hey hun

I feel your pain esp when you mentioned your nightmare evening, I too sent DH out to get formula at 6 am when tesco opened.
Im by no means an expert and am still not back to BF exclusively but just something I thought of is to try after a formula feed, TJ used to get so worked up and screaming so much I couldnt get him on for crying, After a small amout of formula he would calm enough to get him on even if just for comfort and fall asleep.He has more patience when he wasnt as hungry. He used to scream and scream too and I would patiently try for up to an hour re latching for him to come off screaming again seconds later and worked myself into such a state crying more than him, now I try for a while and if he is in a state I just go get a bottle and Iv relaxed much more.

Im so sorry I cant be much more help and wanted to offer my support as Iv shed many a tear over it and know how you feel.
BTW the amount your expressing sounds a good amount for your stage,
Best of luck and hope everything works out real soon

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Monday, January 18th 2010, 1:39am



Also my nipple is hard shape for her tiny mouth so have to kind of hold breast to shape it whilst trying to latch her on.


Yes yes yes! Tiny mouths and big ol' nipples are tricky.

Rightans, if you find that your baby is swinging off the end of your nipple then use the 'scissor technique' (index and middle finger) or your finger and thumb to compress the areola so that the whole of the nipple is more flat while you line it up with baby's mouth. Bring baby to your breast at the split second that the mouth is wide enough and stuff as much of that nipple in as you can. Smile at baby, slide your fingers out of the way and breathe. Remember that it's called breastfeeding, not nipplefeeding and take heart that it's a learned experience like most things in life.





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Monday, January 18th 2010, 1:14pm

Thank you all your advise. It is good to know I am not alone in all this. Bells I will try the scissors technique. I have been holding my breast with the same side hand in sort of C shape. My nipples are on the way to recovery now, so hoping for atleast 2 or 3 good sessions today.
Pam thanks I will try and put him on breast when he is not so frantic and hungry.
Jen well done for getting back to exclusive breastfeeding. I will be seeing midwife again this Wednesday and ask her to show me the position and latch again.
MrsJasper, I will local cafe Mama on Wednesday. Not sure if it meets every Wednesday. Lovely advise about skin to skin. Have been doing little bit of it after reading Bells post on babymoon. I will have a look into you have posted.
Meanwhile I have expressed 1 oz out today and have ordered an electric pump to see if it makes expressing easier.
Once again thanks so much to all. Loads of hugs. :)

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Monday, January 18th 2010, 1:49pm

Hi Rightans,

Fear not, I had a very similar problem with my boy. When he was born he was 5 weeks early, initially he fed find once for 30 mins and then again for an hour, then he refused to suck at all and his blood sugar levels dropped dangerously low and the nurses had to give him formula. I tried to express but nothing came out for 3 whole days and then all I got was a bead on the nipple and nothing else. I was gutted as I really wanted to breastfeed, the mws were really good and they advised me to stick baby on the nipple initially and then top with formula, as he got bigger and stronger he started taking more from the nipple and less formula until he became totally breastfed at 4 weeks old. We also had problems with his weight and were almost sent back to hospital but that was mainly because he seems to have a level of lactose intolerance and throws up most of his formula he was a month old before he regained his birthweight. I also had a problem with latch as Jensen has a mild tongue tie and also wouldn't open his mouth very wide, I found that eventually he would cry because I wouldn't let him latch with a small mouth, then when he opened his mouth to yell I stuck my boob in which didn't work the first couple of times but did eventually, if you make sure he's in the right position in relation to your boob then he should go on in an acceptable position, Jensen was latching too centrally (which is inefficient but not painful) but once we got bfing established I corrected this.

For the first 5 weeks I thought it would never work and was on the verge of quitting as we had all these problems and once I got him on he would only feed for 5 mins and then stop and I was sure he wasn't getting enough. Then he suddenly seemed to get it and now will happily guzzle for 30 mins or more although it's more usual for him to feed for 10 mins.

I guess all I can say is keep persevering and it will eventually come. I can recommend the book "so that's what they're for" as it really helped me.

Jessica

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Monday, January 18th 2010, 5:52pm

Poor Rightans, I'm so sorry you've gone through the mill a bit. It's awful that this sort of thing happens when you're at your lowest ebb after the birth with goodness knows how many hormones swilling about in your system.

I'm absolutely not an expert but just wanted to mention what I did. I had a few tricky days bf-ing my DS and was getting despondent about it as my nipples were pretty sore and I knew if they got too bad I'd be so much more likely to give up. In the end, on about Day 4, I just decided to go back to bed with him. For every feed I'd take him upstairs, strip him off down to his nappy and me down to my bra, then lie down on my side with him snuggled up next to me on the bed. I think the skin-to-skin really helped, plus it turned out HE knew what to do much better than me :snigger: and in that position I didn't need to get him onto me at all - he could just nuzzle himself onto me. It stopped hurting almost immediately, so I calmed down and things became much better.

The other advantage of doing that was that I'd had stitches and sitting down was a bit sore to say the least! Going off to lie down on my side at regular intervals through the day made a big difference to how I felt - I was getting a rest whilst he was getting a feed! Plus it was good to be able to take a break from the visitors!

I kept on like that for several weeks. It really worked for me and I'd recommend it to any new mum because it helps you recover from the birth as well as getting the feeding established. It's not possible to get too much rest at this stage!

Best of luck.
Kitty
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Wednesday, January 20th 2010, 8:10am

How's it going?





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Wednesday, January 20th 2010, 8:22am

I did that too Jessica with DD1 I would just lay down it was just seemed to be the easiest thing to do, then after a week or two we got the hang of it and we slowly began to try other other positions.

I hope it's going well xx

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Chilli" (Jan 23rd 2010, 10:26am)


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Wednesday, January 20th 2010, 6:12pm

How's it going Rightans? Any better?
Kitty
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Wednesday, January 20th 2010, 9:29pm

Thank you ladies. I am making slow progress. I have been putting him to breastfeed last couple of days. Sometimes he latches on well and other times he just wont open his mouth wide or cry. he does tend to sleep on my breast making me wonder if he is getting any. I am defiently producing milk as my breasts feel heavy every couple of hours.
S Midwife visited today and she seemed to think he was latched on alright. Today I have put him to breastfeed every time he is hungry but i have had to top him with formula later on or else he gets too restless. another hurdle is once he takes formula he won't want a feed for long time afterwards. So I am trying to cut down the amount of formula i give him.
Mrsjasper that link is brilliant.
Jessica and Chilli I havent tried the lying down technique as yet as I am afraid that I will doze off while doing that. I use more of crosscradle position.
Grace, thanks for sharing your story with me. I just feel better reading that others have been in the situation i am in and have overcome it. i will see if i can get hold of that book.
Once again thank you so much for your advise. It has made loads of difference to my morale too.

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Wednesday, January 20th 2010, 10:20pm

Well done rightans

Yes try to cut down the amount of formula you give him a little less each time, How much is he taking? Your doing so well hun, Most people would have given up by now so well done on keeping going through tough times.
Hope it gets better soon

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Thursday, January 21st 2010, 2:48am

Hi Rightans, b/f can often be more difficult after elective c/s - milk can take a bit longer to come in and getting comfortable to feed isn't easy. It's still very early days for you, and as long as you can recognise when latching on is correct so your nipples don't get damaged again, you'll get there! You say when you've b/f chikoo, youhave to top him up later with formula as he gets restless. How long after a b/f are you topping him up? Maybe you could try just putting him back to the breast instead. How much formula are you topping him up with? Falling asleep at the beast is very common- it's a lovely comfy place to be!! Try getting him to grip your finger while he feeds, then if he's falling asleep gently pull his arm up so he has to try to hold on - that often works, as the "holding on " reflex and the sucking reflex are linked - both survival instincts.

Hope things are a bit better again tomorrow.

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Thursday, January 21st 2010, 9:12am

Great stuff Rightans, so glad its working out for you, well done.

Fi's mum that interesting about the gripping and sucking reflexes, that explains why DD likes to grip handfuls of boob and pinch!





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Thursday, January 21st 2010, 11:43am

Well done, Rightans, and huge brownie points for persevering. It is so awful if you have any trouble feeding your LO; it's such a primal urge to make sure they are getting enough food and the temptation to use formula is ever present!!

Just a point about the feeding lying down thing - tbh it doesn't really matter if you do drop off - the LO would still be able to feed and from my experience if you do sleep you're still somehow aware that they're there.
Kitty
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Friday, January 22nd 2010, 1:40pm

Thank you ladies for the encouragement.
How much is he taking?
hi Pam, He takes about 2-3 oz of formula. I have been trying to cut it down to 2 oz or 1 oz but not always succsessfuly.

Quoted

. How long after a b/f are you topping him up? Maybe you could try just putting him back to the breast instead. How much formula are you topping him up with? Falling asleep at the beast is very common- it's a lovely comfy place to be!! Try getting him to grip your finger while he feeds, then if he's falling asleep gently pull his arm up so he has to try to hold on -
Chris, usually i top him straight after a breastfeed. he usually asks for his normal feed ie 2-3 oz. as of yesterday night he ennded up having reflux last night. so he only took brestmilk last night and that too not much. i topped him up with 2 oz in the morning as i was too tired being up and worried about how much he got. then he has 2 breastfeeding sessions since then each lasting about 20 mins on each side.

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Friday, January 22nd 2010, 5:15pm

Poor you, I remember being shattered, in tears praying he would feed and go back to sleep, As Chris used to say to me he is getting his food order in for tomorrow :snigger: Night time is when your body is most receptive to stimulation to increase your milk supply so what I try to do is make sure any night feeds are just boob, Id even try a bottle before bed to save having to use one at night but it didnt always work.
Well done on keeping going, I know how hard it is, esp in early days when you are shattered and walking around like a zombie with hormones all over the place, My face used to sting the amount I cried over BF in first weeks.
Hold on in there, you doing a fab job

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Tuesday, February 9th 2010, 2:03pm

1 month on

hi all, just an update. it is month since chikoo's birth. I am still on combination feeding routine. My nipples recovered from the initial damage and i started offering him breast before each feed. He takes 9 ounces worth of top feed every day (last 2 days 11 oz); 3 oz at 11; 3 at about 4 and 3 at 7.00pm. and I think he is so used to that he will cry if not given top up at those times especially the evening feed. yesterday i expressed to see if there was milk in my breast when he was crying for top up evwning feed. only little came out of my left breast and about an ounce came out from right. so there was milk in my right though not 3 oz but still he would not feed. so i am guessing he is getting used to quick milk supply of the bottle at that time. he would take that feed and then sleep for hours afterwards. so i have been ex;ressing the 11.pm feed because he sleeps that time. I only get 1-2 oz out at that time and i use that to top him up during the 11. am top up. and that is the only time i express as i am too afraid that he will wake up and my breasts will be empty. he wakes at night a few times and is exclusively breast fed. i must say that some nights he latches on well and drinks well. Other nights he just nibbles and goes off to sleep on my breast. so by morning i get worried if he is getting any. I did manage to cut down his top up to 6 ounce one day last week but i noticed that soft spot on his head felt a bit sunken and nappies were not so heavy. so i went back to 9 oz and am not able to cut it down further. infact last 2 days he has demanded more than that. his latching is better than before and when he has not latched on well i tend to stuff the rest of areola into his mouth. i have now milk blisters on both brests. i am suspecting that i might have blocked duct on left as it feels very lumpy. any suggestions on how to improve my situations please?

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Thursday, February 11th 2010, 10:17pm

Hey Rightans Sorry cant help with blocke duct question.
I know how you feel, I topped up a while too and managed to exclusively do the night feeds it went downhill for me when he started sleeping through his night feeds and I wasnt heavy or full in the morning as body got used to not producing at that time.
I also remeber being afraid to express in case he woke and I had nothing for him.
Your doing a great job hun you really are. If he needs the top ups then give them to him, Any breastmilk is better than none. TJ gets a feed from me sometimes once a day and my milk is so bad I dont get full even after a whole day of not feeding.
How long is he going between feeds? How long does he stay awake during the day? Does he always sleep on a feed? He may not be taking full feeds from you for falling asleep.
Chris told me a great trick to get him to grip your finger while feeding him and lift his arm above his head, While he is still hungry he will resist but when he is properly asleep he wont resist and his arm will go limp.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "pamelag088" (Feb 11th 2010, 10:20pm)


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Friday, February 12th 2010, 12:34pm

thks pam, i think a hot shower and bit of massage sorted the blocked duct. still got the milk blisters.
I had not thought about he going without his night feeds. At present he feeds 2-4 times at night. but again it is variable. last night i had to give him bottle because he would not take the breast. poor chap vomited it all out. but it breaks my heart when my milk is not suffiecient. i know you have been through this too. well done for breastfeeding against all odds. i am aiming to breastfeed him till i have milk. was hoping somehow i could breastfeed him exclusively. but looks like that may not be possible.

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Friday, February 12th 2010, 4:20pm

:hugs: I know how you feel hun its heartbreaking.
Is he a good sleeper? I found once I switched to bottles that TJ was often overtired, I knew he couldnt be hungry as he just had a big bottle but before your so scared they are hungry i just fed and fed which led him to snack every hour or less sometimes, Then when he wanted a big feed I didnt have enough as he had been taking in between feeds but never filling himself.
The night feeds will keep your supply good, TJ fed lovely at night probably because he really was hungry and would take a full feed. Being anxious doesnt help either but all this is easy for me to say now as Iv relaxed so much, A month or so ago I was so worked up every minute of the day and boobs and milk was all I thought about. Now that Iv learned what TJ likes I wish I could do it again as I would be so much calmer(i think) Im guessing you are same... on edge all the time.
Your doing such a good job, best avice I can give you is ENJOY your baby whether you feed him by breast or bottle, dont feel a failure cuz you certainly are not.
Maybe Bells will have some better advice for you(chirs has just became a granny so suspec she wont be on for a while :D )
Sorry I cant be more help :sadface:

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Friday, February 12th 2010, 9:43pm

Thanks Pam. You have been such ahelp. Had a real bad day today as Chikoo did not breastfeed at all. I have decided to bottlefeed now. I will offer him breasts and expressed milk but will not be persistent as I want him to gain weight and be content. Like you said unfortunately we don't get a second chance at it becauuse now i realise what i did wrong.

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Saturday, February 13th 2010, 1:07am

Hey hun
When you say he doesnt breastfeed is this cuz he is refusing breast? Or isnt latching on properly?
I was lucky with TJ he didnt seem to mind swapping from bottle to boob, If you intend to keep BF I would keep him on as slow a flow of teat as you can so he doesnt prefer the faster flow.
If you want to make this work I think you can, If you feel you will regret giving in then with right help I believe you could do it. Only reason Im telling you this is because Iv had a hard time forgiving myself for stopping but I think Im beyond repair now.
If on the other hand you are 100% happy with bottlefeeding then thats great, Your milk diminishes very quickly I think about a week I went from expressing 10oz a day to practically nothing and that was feeding maybe once or twice a day still.
Im not trying to put pressure on you and please dont think Im trying to make you change your mind I just want you to make sure you are 100% happy with your decision for YOUR sake as I really miss it.

I went a week trying to up my supply and it worked but I dont think I was patient enough to see it through, I was taking fenugreek( I still have an unopened tub if you want it Il send it to you) and stayed in bed with skin to skin feeding very very often, maybe every half hour, I went from expressing 1-2 oz to 5 oz in 1 session in that time.

I hope you dont feel like Im putting any pressure on you as I know thats not what you need right now, Im just scared you will end up like me and regret it. But like I said if your happy with your decision then thats great and I completely undertand what the constant worry and feeling like the only one can do to you.

If you fancy the fenugreek PM me your addy and Il get it posted, I also have all the ingredients for the drink mentioned in top of BF post, Il give you that too if Im poking my nose in where it isnt wanted just tell me to p**s off :snigger:

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Saturday, February 13th 2010, 2:15pm

Hey Pammy, first of all a huge hug to you.
yes he was refusing my breast yesterday. he would just spit it out. latching has always been a problem but we have made great improvement in that respect. I use tommee tippee's closer to nature bottles. they are low flow arent they?
Thanks Pammy, i do make it want to work but yesterday when he wasnt drinking and crying i felt bad for forcing him to take breast. i think the reason was he has come to prefer the fast flow from the bottles. Also he will wait till he is really hungry before demading feed and then get really frantic. i have tried waking him up and feeding him before he demands but it did not work.
i do want it to work coz when he had his big feed from bottle yesterday. i expressed his two missed feeds. i even put an alarm at night to express. i got about 4 oz from two expressed feeds which he had this morning. luckily he started taking my breast again last night. though i think he was just snacking, kept waking me up every hour.

i did try fenugreek tea as i had some fenugreek seeds at home which i use for curries sometime. but then i stopped making the tea as he was refusing to feed and wondered if fenugreek was making the milk bitter. i also eat lot of almonds on health visitors recommendation.
i am willing to try the elixir recommended above. do you think it made a difference? could you tell me where you got the ingredients for it? thank you so much for your offer to send it to me. that is so kind but i dont want to burden you further. your support through this has been amazing.

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Saturday, February 13th 2010, 3:19pm

I will easily send it to you as I have no use for it anymore, I got the rehydrate and rescue remedy from boots online and the balckcurrent elixir I got from ebay health shop, then you just need your apple juice. I tried it for a few days and I felt better in myself and with the increased feeding I did feel it made a difference.
I agree with the fast flow thing I think my letdown got slower and slower the less milk I made and it was hard getting him to stay on long enough to get letdown going then even after letdown he only sucked while milk was coming fast. I emailed LLL who mentioned nipple confusion too.

I understand him gettin all worked up and finding it hard to get him on, Maybe you could try giving him an oz or so formula before the feed to calm him slightly although TJ goes mental when you take the bottle away so maybe that wouldnt work for you. I also know where your coming from saying you feel bad for forcing him, I too felt like that. http://www.laleche.org.uk/pages/about/helpform.htm Here is the link I used to email the LLL and although she never solved my problems she gave me a lot of info I found helpful.

Here is some more tips I found on trying to calm him before latching

Baby is hungry, but is too upset to nurse.
1) Put your small index finger in the baby's mouth, palm side up. Make sure your nail is trimmed short. It helps to wet the finger first. Rub the tip of your finger in the hollow in the top of the baby's mouth and your finger against baby's upper and lower lip. Once baby is calm, transfer to a real nipple. This is also a great way to temporarily placate a baby when food isn't available.
2) While you are trying to get the baby to latch on, put the palm of your hand on the baby's cheek.
3) While you are trying to get the baby to latch on, blow gently on the baby's face. This works really well on Hal -- he gets upset and hot and red from crying, and the hot face seems to keep him upset. He cools down when you blow gently on his face, and calms down enough to latch.
4) Let the baby grip the fingers of one hand (one of your fingers per baby hand). Your hands can't be wet or cold or this won't work.

I am maybe sticking my nose in where it isnt wanted and Im really sorry if I am but just feel your not ready to give up yet

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Saturday, February 13th 2010, 3:29pm

Me again, just re-read your post

Wondering if maybe your letdown is slow and this is why he keeps spitting it out? Does it take long with the pump to get the milk flowing? When he is refusing the breast is he spitting it out almost as soon as he is on or swallowing a while then spitting it out?
Chris always said to me your letdown reflux is affected by stress it can delay the milk ducts releasing the milk as fast as the baby would like. I know I was stressed all the time and when he hit 6 weeks when pumping it took forever to get the milk flowing and this is when I started actually feeling letdown happening.
If this is case you could try getting milk flowing with your pump 1st then putting him on after and see if this makes a difference

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Sunday, February 14th 2010, 8:40pm

sorry could not reply earlier as had visitors today. you are being really helpful and really appreciate it. :thanx: blowkiss i think my letdown gets slower as the day progresses. it is alright early morning and night time. problem is don't get time to express during daytime. Chikoo too gets annoyed when i take the botle away to burp him. but will try giving him just an oz and then putting him to breast.
I will have a look at the link. gtg he is a bit unsettled this evening. will come baCK on later.

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Sunday, February 14th 2010, 10:01pm

I get where your coming from with it getting worse through the day, I was exact same, I could exclusively feed all day but evening(from 5 til about 1 am) I had very little left and this is when I did my top ups. I think(from what Iv read) slower flow is linked to low supply.
Its so heartbreaking when it doesnt go the way you hoped it would, I think Iv looke up every page there is on internet to try and find solutions but my problem seemed to be very rare and all they said was to increase feeding to increase supply but you cant increase feeding when they refuse to nurse :sadface:
Have you spoke to your HV? Mine wasnt very helpful just said I was doing a good job but I needed advice as I knew it was going wrong.
Hope you get him settled soon xfingers

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Monday, February 15th 2010, 1:02pm

yes pam i do think my supply is low. and my lo is feeding ineffectively so it will go down further. for some reason he wouldnot feed from my right side which is my good side. i did try your trick and expressed a bit before offering him and it seemed to work for a while but soon he was upset again.
Have you spoke to your HV? Mine wasnt very helpful just said I was doing a good job but I needed advice as I knew it was going wrong.
Hope you get him settled soon xfingers
mine isnt very helpful either. she just tells me stories of how others did it but that's not helpful in my personal situation.

i will pm you my address.

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Tuesday, February 16th 2010, 12:19pm

Chikoo had 11 oz of topup yesterday. he ended up having bad reflux last night. i amnot getting much sleep that could be the reason for low supply too. i think i will aim for combination feed for now rather than exclusive bf as the way i am going is not sustainable. i was hoping that i could replace the top ups with exprssed milk but due to low suplly not been able to dothat. :sadface: pAMMY havent pmed you as yet coz not sure what way i will be going.

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Tuesday, February 16th 2010, 8:14pm

No problem hun

As long as your happy with your decision then thats all that matters no matter what it may be. You can mix for as long as you like as long as your feeding you will make milk. It sometimes really helps to relax a while and just stop worrying about it until you make a decision

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Sunday, February 21st 2010, 3:25pm

thks pammy, i will happily breastfeed him till i can and he is willing. i am much morecrelaxed about it now. thanks to everyone on this thread am i still breastfeeding though he is having half his feed through bottle. when i had that short stint in the hos;pital with hi weight loss and my bleedding nipples i had thought my breastfeeding days are over. but i am ha;ppy i am giving little bit of his feed.

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Sunday, February 21st 2010, 3:30pm

Thats great hun
So good you have reached a decision your happy with, I think thats the most important thing as it means you relax and stop worrying which makes life a hell of a lot easier.
You have done a good job through the pain and worry with his weight. I never had that and not sure I would have lasted as long as I did if I were in your shoes.
Well done :D




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